Brian Stanley urges universal plans to speed housing delivery

Thank you, Laskin and Corley. The housing finance agency amendment bill, the amendment 87 bill, it would be hard to oppose it. It is increasing the amount of finance available which is needed. The key issue is that it is at low interest rates. I do not know if a portion of it is coming from the European Investment Bank or on the private markets. We are in the middle of a housing crisis like we have never seen before. We really need to try and deal with it. The cost of delivery and the speed of the delivery are key issues, along with the need for infrastructure, Minister. Water, electricity, waste water capacity is really, really important. It is what we need to do. There are a few areas where we can do something. I would suggest, I would say this to you, I have raised it before and I am going to raise it again here today. It is unfortunate that the two housing ministers have left the chamber. I have spoken to both of them before about it, along with the other minister for state from Waterford in relation to it. What I would say to you is that local authority housing, local authority housing, how they were built quickly before was we used universal designs, universal plans, not just designs and standards. The department officials have told me in the past, oh we are moving towards having universal design or universal standards for inside and all of that. But I am talking about the exact same plan. The exact same plan Ciancola and Minister could be used in terms of for different family sizes, for different settings. So in other words, a two-bedroomed, two-storey urban unit, two-storey would be the same in Westmead where you live and where I live in County Leash or in Donegal or in Wexford. A masonette, a one- or two-bedroom masonette for a pensioner or disabled person could be the same again throughout the country. A three- and four-bed the same and we need to do that. The fear of, and I am not saying this by any way that we drop standards, the standard of accommodation, it has to be A-rated. That is not what I am saying. This is not about cutting corners, this is about simply cutting out the nonsense and the cost. At the moment local authorities are costing between 11 and 15 percent to design plans for each housing estate that is being built and each housing development. They start with a blank canvas and then pieces of paper get shuffled between the local authority and the customs house and that needs to stop. I will acknowledge that it has speeded up a bit in the last few years but it needs to be cut out altogether. You know, if you look at what's built in a lot of this city, a lot of those houses, if you go to Sligo you see the same houses, there are houses like them in Portlaoise. You know, I pass houses every day coming in here and I lived in one the very same as them in Portlaoise. No problem. So I am not talking about going back to the 1930s type housing. We can have modern housing. What I am saying is, it is the same plan and you do not hire architects. You know, you should not be starting with a blank canvas for every house that is being developed or every small or large housing scheme. Universal drawings, universal plans, universal design for the different family needs in the different settings. That is what we need to speed up delivery and crucially to reduce costs. We are talking about it here every day. You cannot reduce costs unless you mass produce. You have to mass produce. You know, and do people really care up and down the country that the house they are living in might somehow look like the one someone else is living in Donegal? They don't. You know, and the private developers are doing it to simply change maybe a little bit of the fabric on the outside of the front or change the porch a little bit or some other feature slightly to make them look slightly different. They are all doing them. I can see houses are being built by some of the the big building contractors in County Leish and the very same ones are being built in Dublin. They don't mind doing it but the local authorities are sent off to get new plans each time and we need to call out that nonsense and it needs to stop and as I said I have raised it with the three housing ministers. So I would like to see that and somebody might come back and tell me what is happening with that. And I don't want to hear that they are using standard, you know, same standards internally and this and that and the other. It is the same plans we need. That is what is needed. In relation to speeding up delivery that is actually crucial. And just in relation, if we just move to the budget for a second, that the budget, in the budget and the document that the minister read out, I have a copy of it here, that there is over nine billion and I welcome that and I wish there was more in it but it is good that that much is in it. But again it is the value we are getting for that. And can I just highlight to you one thing, that there is two billion of that, two billion of that according to the minister is for RAS and housing assistance and leasing, right? That is a huge sum of money. I understand why we need to do that. We brought in rent subsidies back in rent supplement back 30 years ago as a short-term measure, but now it is becoming the mainstay of providing housing for 100,000 households. So, you know, this is dead money down the drain every year, which we, okay, we get short-term housing for, but we can pay it for years, we can pay it for 50 years, the state will not have any asset, it does not have a tangible asset at the end of it. But I also highlight to you that out of that nine billion for housing, nine billion plus, there is less than one third of that actually going to local authorities, according to the minister's speech, less than one third of it to actually build, to actually build and buy. And that shows the shift. So over two thirds of the money is going somewhere else. The money that we are putting in for social and affordable housing, over two thirds is going completely somewhere else, instead of into that being the main focus of where it should go to. So just to highlight that to you, and I'm saying that, I'm saying that because I'm concerned about the cost, I'm concerned about the speed of the livery, and I'm just concerned about time wasted, you know, going to jump through hoops that don't need to be jumped through. Could I just say that in that, you know, that if you take that two billion in RAS and Hap and Leeson, you know, it's a substantial money to be, and the Public Accounts Committee done a report on this number of years ago, and an in-depth investigation into it found that it's bad value for money. So I do think we need to change the dial and get the emphasis towards getting houses in place. With Leeson County Council, for example, they have a spend of this year 491 million, sorry, 491,000, my apologies, 491,000 for Hap alone. And for leasing and for taking leasing and all of the other things with it, looking at 14 million, I have a budget of around 30 million for housing. So half the budget, half the budget is going on temporary payments. You know, we'll go to landlords and various other outfits to just for temporary leasing and temporary renting. So that's the effects that's happening. You know, and it's money, it's money that we don't finish up with a tangible asset for. And that's not a good way of doing business. And we've become overly dependent on that. The money for grants, and the grant schemes are excellent. You know, the housing adaptation, the mobility aids, and the housing aid for older persons. I think there needs to be a little bit of flexibility around the housing aid for older persons that I think wants people to hit over 60, you know, there should be, in certain circumstances, it should be able to reduce it downwards a bit instead of 66. But it's a very good grant, and hopefully there will be a second tranche of money there for next year. I wanted to mention to you about cost rentals. And there's been a trickle of them, right? When you go outside the pail, it's only a trickle. And they're needed every bit as badly there, because you have a lot of people now in their 50s and in their 60s, and they're in private rented accommodation. They will not be able to, they're facing rent increases. Some of them now are facing homelessness because of the changes in the rent rules, and are being served with notices for vacant possession. And this is causing a real problem. This is causing a real problem. But the issue here is, the overall issue here is that there's a, what I'm highlighting here is that there's a group, a cohort of people who will not get alone anywhere, will not get alone anywhere because of the rage profile. And also, you know, they're, they're spent, they're buying power, their income limits. And that needs to be, we need cost rental homes for those, those people and those families. And they are families, in some cases, minister. And they are, they are single people. So in towns like Rathdowney, in towns like Mount Trat, and Abbey Leakes, and Great Cullen, and Port Arlington, and Strath Valley, and Mount Melich, in those towns in Port Arlington, we need cost rental indoors, not just in Portlaoise. There'll be a small few coming in Portlaoise, and they're welcome. But we need more of them cost rentals, and we need more affordable to purchase. We need to get back to the idea of getting people, allowing people to be able to buy their own home. And those costs can be brought down. And one of the things that we can do is to shave off to 11 or 15% straight away with this nonsense with design, new designs with everyone we come to, every, every new scheme. Can I just say to you, and I'm saying all this in a constructive way, suggestions, right? I want to say to you about, about the finance and the money for building houses. There's a record amount of money on deposit apparently in this country. We also have record debts, okay? But there's a record amount of money in savings, right? And we should set up like, there was a state savings scheme set up. And perhaps we should be looking at, you know, a citizen's bond, housing bonds, right? And if people are getting a couple of percent on their investment on that, you know, it would be a great way of utilising some of that money. The backstop is to stay it. And I'm not talking about risky, risky loans and furring money around like we did. Well, not like I did, but the way some people, the way further around by the banks than that during the Celtic Tiger. But in sound investments that we would, you know, allow money to be invested in sustainable housing schemes, and in, you know, and in cost rentals as well. That's an issue, you know, on citizens bonds. I think the government, it's an untapped source of wealth and money that's there that could be used for that. One question I have is, and the final thing I wrap up with, Laskin Corley, if you bear with me, is the unencumbered AHBs. I'm for the AHBs. There's a problem though. A lot of them have grown up now and come of age. And what I mean by that is, is the finance period, they're out of the encumbered period where they have a finance liability to the state. And they've come out now for 25 years in existence, such a scheme. And what's happening there is, is that some of them are now being managed by private companies, right? And there's an issue here arising. I've highlighted this to the department before. I don't know what's happening with it at the moment. And the three things that arise as they arise is this. One is who will own them. The second thing is that how will they be managed, you know, and will they be available to the local authorities to rent? Will, in other words, if number six, such and such a street comes available, and it's in an AHB, and it's out of the encumbered period, what happens? Does the local authority nominate the tenant to the housing body? Or is the housing body free to do what they like, and charge whatever rent they like? And that's happening, along with hello money. That is also happening. I'd like that some of the officials could come back to me on that. Thank you.