Brian Stanley challenges Reserve Defence Forces funding and training
Brian Stanley questioned the state, funding and training of the Reserve Defence Forces, arguing current budgets and paid-days fail to cover basic training. He pressed officials on strength figures, training requirements, travel and allowances and highlighted allocations in the 2015 white paper.
Brian Stanley noted conflicting strength figures in the session, asking whether current numbers were "about 940". Respondents later cited a Reserve strength of 1,700 against a stated target of 4,500, while the Permanent Defence Forces target was given as 11,500.
He outlined training benchmarks quoted by witnesses: 26 days to reach two-star private level, another 26 days to three-star, and an annual minimum training requirement of about 12 days. Active reservists commonly undertake 50 to 80 days of training; unit camps and fortnight blocks remain but are now less common and are often replaced by formal seven- and 14-day courses.
Stanley highlighted the paper's budget figures, describing the Reserve budget as "0.34 of the total defence spending" and referring to a figure of 3.5 million. He drew attention to the 2015 white paper allocation of seven paid days per reservist per year and warned that seven paid days do not even cover initial basic training of 26 days.
He raised concerns about security duties and travel burdens for reservists, noting that many training centres and reserve outposts have closed so members often travel long distances at their own expense. He also highlighted that reservists do not receive the same additional allowances for security duties that members of the Permanent Defence Forces receive.
Stanley emphasised there is no regular salary, retainer or gratuity for reservists and that the limited paid days and low budget allocation create a disconnect between required training and funded entitlement. He framed these points as barriers to reaching planned Reserve strength and sustaining capability.
Key points on strength and targets
Brian Stanley noted conflicting strength figures in the session, asking whether current numbers were "about 940". Respondents later cited a Reserve strength of 1,700 against a stated target of 4,500, while the Permanent Defence Forces target was given as 11,500.
Training time and requirements
He outlined training benchmarks quoted by witnesses: 26 days to reach two-star private level, another 26 days to three-star, and an annual minimum training requirement of about 12 days. Active reservists commonly undertake 50 to 80 days of training; unit camps and fortnight blocks remain but are now less common and are often replaced by formal seven- and 14-day courses.
Budget and paid days under the white paper
Stanley highlighted the paper's budget figures, describing the Reserve budget as "0.34 of the total defence spending" and referring to a figure of 3.5 million. He drew attention to the 2015 white paper allocation of seven paid days per reservist per year and warned that seven paid days do not even cover initial basic training of 26 days.
Operational duties, travel and allowances
He raised concerns about security duties and travel burdens for reservists, noting that many training centres and reserve outposts have closed so members often travel long distances at their own expense. He also highlighted that reservists do not receive the same additional allowances for security duties that members of the Permanent Defence Forces receive.
Pay and retention implications
Stanley emphasised there is no regular salary, retainer or gratuity for reservists and that the limited paid days and low budget allocation create a disconnect between required training and funded entitlement. He framed these points as barriers to reaching planned Reserve strength and sustaining capability.
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Transcript
Mr. Carthy, Mr. Richardson and Mr. Gargan, you're very welcome and I'm delighted that you're here because I've raised the issue of the Reserve Defence Forces a couple of times and there's a few things, a few things have been a revelation to me. I think the figures that were given was that the strength of us is down at about 940, is that correct at the moment? We have seen growth in recent times. Okay, but compared to what it used to be, we'd say, under Forest Cusunda or Chula, it's a fraction of that. And just a couple of questions. And the paper supplied is very good because it outlines, it's a revelation as well in terms of that the total budget for it is 0.34 of the total defence spending. You know, it does show being given low priority, 3.5 million. So, and a third of a million in, or sorry, 0.34 of the overall spending of the defence budget. But the questions I have is just in relation to, you know, I'm trying to understand the amount of time that's involved with, say, you know, typically what's expected of you in terms of time training, you know, travel deployments and security duties mentioned in your document. Just in a couple of sentences, if you can just outline that for me, just briefly. I know our time is short and I don't want to be abrupt with you because of that, you know. Thanks. Because I have a number of other questions. Care luck if I could take those, just by way of response. Just briefly, just to give us a kind of a picture. No trouble. That's expected. Training, minimum training for a reservist is approximately 26 days to be trained as a reservist. So it's 26 days to get a person from a recruit to what's referred to as a two-star private level. Another 26 days to get them up to what's called three-star private level. And at that point, they're considered a fully trained reservist and they can go for a whole raft of other courses. But the key point to make in this is that our minimum training requirement annually equates to about 12 days, thereabouts, in terms of hours. That's the bare minimum a reservist needs to do. But the vast majority of reservists will partake in an awful lot more range of training or courses or duties, as we discussed earlier. So the average is actually about 50 to sometimes 80 days for particularly active reservists. So it's really, at this point, how much a reservist is able to commit. But the minimum requirement is 12 days per annum, but about 26 days to get trained in the first instance. We know, for example, though, that the white paper on defence back from 2015 only allocated seven paid days per annum to every member of the reserve. That's where the budget came from or where it started off in 2015. But your initial entrance course is 26 days, and under the white paper, we were allocated seven paid days each. So it doesn't even equate to cover basic training. Now, the fact that our numbers are beneath our overall establishment meant that there was funding allocation for other activities. But if we had a 4,000-strand full reserve right now, the budget would technically only be supposed to cover seven paid days per annum, and it takes 26 days. What I would ask is the activities typically, because obviously if day jobs, you know, recruits in it, members of it, the, you know, the tasks are mainly performed at weekends. It would be a mixture of evenings, weekends, and then one or two week blocks. And the security duties would be at barracks around the country. Exactly, Deputy. And on the security duty point, as Senator Crockwell mentioned, a lot of reserve outposts or training centres closed in recent years. So for Reserves to actually come to a location where they can engage in military duties, for some, it's a significant drive, all at their own expense. And then when they're actually undertaking this security duty, they are not in receipt of the additional allowance that members of the Permanent Defence Forces get. There's no allowance for travel around like that? No, no, no, no, Deputies. So just to move on kind of quickly then, and in terms of the target that the department have and the government have, and the higher echelons of the Defence Forces, what's the target for it? What strength do they wish to bring it to? Well, for the Permanent Defence Forces, it's 11,500. Yes, for us it's 4,500. 4,500, and at the moment you're at 1,700. 1,700, correct. Okay, so you're about a third of the way there. And just in relation to, there's another question I had on me, as well, just in relation to the, you know, there's no regular salary, there's no retainer, no gratuity, there isn't anything like that. It's just, yeah, it's for duty to be paid. And in relation to, you know, years ago if you were working with fellows who were in the FCA at that time, they would go away on camp every year, and it was typically during their work holidays, they would go for a fortnight to camp. Is there still that fortnight block every year? Does that still happen? That still takes place, Deputy. It's less common than it used to be. Unit camp is a sort of a recurrency event, so individuals are engaging in recurrency training, whereas now most seven- and 14-day blocks are formalised courses where reservists are learning a new skill as opposed to engaging in recurrency for stuff they've already learned. So camp, as a notion, has sort of drifted away in recent years and been replaced with conducting courses over these seven- or 14-day blocks, but it's a very similar setup, it's a similar model. And just in terms of tasks as well, we say, you know, typically the Defence Forces are brought in at times when, you know, when there's a crisis, severe flooding, or after storms or something like that, or major security events or something like that. Is, you know, would the reserve be called up in those situations? Absolutely, Deputy, and regularly are. And if I can just mention briefly, like, some of the things that, like, reservists have done in recent times in that regard. Patient transportation, critical patients during extreme weather events. We were widely used during the COVID pandemic in testing centres, either support staff or, indeed, conducting swabbing. We have cyber defence reservists that take part in cyber coalition exercises. Reservists involved in Defence Forces research and innovation. We have professional mariners that serve in our naval service reserves, so they take their external qualifications and apply them in that sphere. Recently, we had a reservist deploy to Cyprus as part of an overseas mission to help train Ukrainians in de-mining as part of the EU military assistance mission. So we're at a point now where reservists are engaging in quite high-profile activities in support of the state, and then widespread day-to-day tasks as well in support of the permanent defence forces. And can we just move on to the department's position and the minister's position? The tarnish, obviously, is a welcome intervention, and, you know, Mr. Carrigan said that it took your appearance here this morning. So it's worthwhile coming, if you can even get that moving, because sometimes these things move at lessier pace, right? So it's a worthwhile and a welcome step forward, and hopefully that can bear fruit. But just in relation to the, you know, there's a document we received from the department, and it's a letter of instruction. And it said that it sets out in relation to the situation with the pay. It said 23, the defence forces issued a letter of instruction relating to such payments. The letter of instruction was regrettably not consistent with the regulations and resulted in payments being met for activities which there was no provision in the defence force's remuneration or sanction for payment. And they're basically saying this was an error, right? I won't read all the document, I haven't time to do it. I'll just wrap up now, Coylelock, in a moment. But this is the important bit. They said that the defence forces are considering the position, and if they wish to extend the number of pet activities for RDF, any case met will be considered by the tarnished and minister of defence. This is the normal procedure. While work is ongoing, the defence forces are working on possible solutions for members of the RDF. So that would seem to be saying in that letter, which I saw when I got this morning, that they're trying to do something in the interim in terms of doing it. And I suppose just in terms of how we can help maybe that the committee maybe would make representations both deeper, because deeper, I think one of the other speakers said that deeper does hold the purse rings. The cake is only so big, I know that, right? And obviously, you know, funding has to come somewhere. It can't be pulled out of the sky. But I do think, you know, we're talking about a very, very small amount of money here for the services being provided. And I just think I've raised the reserve before here, because I just feel that it's an area that, as a state and as a country, we haven't given due attention to or credit to, right? I said this in your absence, so I'm telling you what I think about it. And I just think that would be useful for us as a committee to make representations to both departments and to the tarnished on your behalf, if the committee is agreeable to that. Thanks and thanks for it. And we may finish it with that, but I'll take that as a proposal to right to deeper and to the tarnished on the back of today's hearings. Okay, we go next.