Kathleen Funchion presses for clarity on surrogacy and guardianship

Thank you very much Cahirleach and thank you Minister for taking this question because I do understand that it doesn't fall solely into your department and I do want to say that I really appreciate that from the outset so it's in relation to concerning a child's guardianship status that their rights are ensured from the perspective of the best interest of the child and if you will make a statement on the matter. Thanks. Thank you Chair, thank you Deputy. The issue of guardianship is a matter for the courts in the first instance under the Guardianship of Infants Act of 1964 however I have a continuing interest in ensuring the legal and practical arrangements for the welfare of children are well founded and appropriately applied at all times. As Minister in this department I have no formal or defined role in the determination of cases where there is a legal issue about the guardianship of a child that is and must be a matter for the courts. In addition however there are guardianship matters to be considered relating to children in the care of Tusla. Children are received into Tusla's care either through a voluntary agreement or by way of a care order issued by the courts each of which are provided for under the Child Care Act of 1991. My responsibilities in this area relate to care orders under the Child Care Act 1991 rather than to the Guardianship of Infants Act which is under the aegis of the courts and the Minister for Justice. In terms of the actions under the Minister and Department for Justice under Section 6C of the Guardianship of Infants Act 1964 a person can apply to court to be appointed as a child's guardian if he or she is married to or in a civil partnership with the child's parent or has cohabited with the child's parent for over three years and if the person has shared responsibility for the child's day to day care for more than two years. As issues relating to surrogacy concern areas of law that intersect across the remits of several government departments, the Minister for Health, the Minister for Justice, the Attorney General and I are continuing to work together on these matters and the provisions of Section 6C of the Guardianship of Infants Act are currently being examined in that context. As the three Ministers we've met now on three occasions on this specific issue and we've also met with the Attorney General on one occasion as well. So work is ongoing among our officials on how to address the relevant and very complex legal issues in a matter that vindicates the rights of the child. Thank you and thanks Minister and yes surrogacy I suppose was the the reason behind me raising this and as I said I do understand there's other Ministers involved but I suppose from a children's rights point of view and also as well to be able to just raise this issue in the chamber particularly as the health department is so limited with questions at the moment due to the cyber attack. I think it's important that we really do keep it on the agenda and the key issues really are I suppose the Dr. Conor O'Mahony's report he did an excellent report on this and it's really important that the recommendations in that report are looked at and you know he really has some excellent recommendations and also I think just Dr. O'Mahony in general is really well placed to be looking at this issue. I know as well that there are difficulties around international surrogacy in the proposed bill this isn't actually accounted for an international surrogacy is you know it's a big part of it and we have to be all be very honest about that and it's important that that is considered and I also know that families are really concerned about retrospection that exist in families that it's not a case that maybe the bill is passed you know here in 2021 is it just going to be from this year going forward or will it take other families in I'll come back in in my supplementary supplementary minute again thanks thanks thanks deputy maybe just to address some of the matters that that do and I should say these do fall within the remit of the department of health but the drafting of a bill on assisted human reproduction and associated of research was based on the published general scheme of the assisted human reproduction bill which was published in the last all and work on that drafting on that is ongoing by officials in the department of health and it's a commitment in the program for government that that legislation would be passed the legislation is comprehensive it encompasses the regulation for the first time in Ireland of a range of practices including domestic altruistic surrogacy and the provisions related to surrogacy are dealt with in part six of the bill and the bill sets out a court-based mechanism through which the parentage of a child born through surrogacy may be transferred from the surrogate and her husband if applicable to the intended parent as the deputy stated it doesn't deal with commercial surrogacy on an international basis and as the deputy stated Dr O'Mahony has brought forward a report with recommendations in that regard and that report is also being examined by the three ministers and by the attorney general Thanks very much Minister I'm really glad to hear that and I think it'll be welcome news for families who have gone through surrogacy or who are facing surrogacy in the near future and it is going to be something I suppose and it's welcome that it's it's there as an option as well and I'm sure it will be something that we will see a lot more of in the near future so just in relation to that report and I do think as well it's important and I know that maybe I think you've met with some of the some of the families and some of the advocacy groups but I know that certainly they would be open to meeting with yourself with Minister Donnelly with any minister that that you know that they need to meet with and they really kind of get their story across really really well and I just want to commend them for all of their work I want to also just really briefly mention like issues around obviously parental leave and maternity leave and maternity leave and maternity benefit and all those areas that probably some of us take for granted that they're so important as well and I suppose just I'm glad to hear the comments that you've made so far and I do appreciate as I said I know it's not only your area but I suppose just I think the crux of it really is Dr Omani's report thanks chair our last can call on thanks thanks deputy well look this is an issue that does spread across a number of departments I think that's why it's important that the three ministers are working together and are meeting regularly together and we're hoping to meet again in the near future to continue our discussions we're getting support from the attorney general on the issue and that's why I think it's a very important and it's important that is an alliance formed in this particular area and I think it is important that for children who are here in Ireland conceived through surrogacy and deeply loved by the parents it is important that provision is made for them. Obviously in all this when a child is conceived of surrogacy there are a number of individuals a number of adults involved and it is important that I think we know from our experience in the area of adoption about all parties who are involved and I think that from my department that's one of the points that I'll be bringing to this the discussion on this legislation that a child has to know all parties involved in their at their conception mail market